The Widdershins

A little dis and dat, points to ponder

Posted on: January 30, 2019

Good day to you Widdershins!

You may have noticed that mb has not been around the past few days.  It appears that the real world and her job have taken her away from us. However, she assured us she will be back.  LOL

The other day we were discussing the announced 2020 Democratic candidates for President.  Some of us were wondering who Kamala Harris had previously supported for Prez.  Shadowfax said that she, Harris, had supported Barrack Obama.  I’m guessing that was the 2008 election. For me, that was a particularly odious election.  It was pretty cut-throat between Obama and Clinton and after the Rules and Bylaws committee meeting (or was it the Credentials committee?) of the DNC I decided I would vote for McCain in the general election.  It’s not that I supported him or his veep choice Palin.  It’s that I was that angry at the way I thought the DNC screwed over Hillary.

We know that by the time of the convention Hillary and Obama had “made up” and she endorsed him. But there were lots of us who were not happy about it.  That’s when the PUMA movement came about. There were lots of hard feelings back then.

But now we are heading into the 2020 Presidential election cycle.  2008 was two cycles ago.  Do we or should we care that much right now about who supported whom in that election?  Or should we consider more who has the best chance of defeating tRump if he’s still around and runs for reelection?

Personally I’m not going to worry that much about who supported/endorsed a candidate back then.

Right now Harris is the latest bright, shiny object in front of Democrats. I watched a large part of the Iowa town hall she held.  She was articulate, answered people’s questions well and came off pretty good.  However it’s a long time between now and the primaries and the general.  Should we still be concerned about who supported Obama in 2008 and keep it up like a feud between the Hatfields and McCoys?  Or should we be more concerned about who has the best chance of appealing to the voters and defeating tRump or Pence or whomever the Repubs run in 2020?


Open thread naturally.



76 Responses to "A little dis and dat, points to ponder"

Kamala Harris did support and campaign for Obama, but then a lot of people did. I agree with you that at this point it’s water under the bridge. There are much more recent examples of loyalty we can judge by. And it’s important to note that not everyone who supported Obama in 2008 did so out of some ill will towards HRC. In elections you make choices, we all do. The choice itself, I think, can less important than the behavior around that choice. That’s why, for example, Ted Kennedy and Donna Brazile can go on a long walk off a short pier. They are two people I will never forgive. (Of course, Brazile has more recent examples of fuckery that are as unforgivable as her actions in 2008.)

And it is two damned years before the election. If we thought the last election was long……… oy.

@1; Good points DYB. Brazilenut is one I still grit my teeth whenever I see her on tv and right before I change the channel.

And it is two damned years before the election.
Yes that!

I was that angry at the way I thought the DNC screwed over Hillary.

Oh yes. It was the Rules Board(Bylaws?) Committee. May 31, 2008 — I still remember the date. I was floored that they gave Hillary’s delegates to Obama. Now that was rigging the primary system. Then the Obamabots with their misogyny and bullying at the caucuses, plus some very odd happenings at some of the caucuses. I voted for McCain too, Fredster. The only time I’ve voted Repub.

But this is Jan 2019. Has there been any election cycle where candidates declared so early??? Crazy. Harris is my current choice; she’s smart and spirited, but neither she nor anyone else comes close to Hillary’s qualifications. It will be bittersweet to see a woman POTUS, if I do see one in my lifetime. Might it really be possible? All the women elected in 2018 give me hope.

However, I’m for any Dem who can win against Trump.

@3: And I wanted to add: I mentioned shadow in the piece because someone asked who Harris endorsed. I had no idea because I wasn’t even aware of Harris back then. But shadow being in the Bay Area was aware of her endorsement.

Harris is my choice to; as of now. But this will be a long campaign and there are gonna be goofs, gaffes and mistakes made by many and probably her too. We still don’t know who else may declare.

I think we all have been though Hell since 2007. The extreme happiness and pride, to anger, disbelief and numbness, rinse and repeat.

Hillary is the only candidate I contributed to, met, held her hand, went to Denver with other PUMAs and marched until I almost passed out in the freaking, airless heat.

I learned many things that year, that changing others vote is almost impossible, and you can just do what you can for your candidate and if the Russian’s, crooks, GOP, Iran or China don’t screw ya, probably someone else will.

Other than Robert Kennedy, who was shot when I voted for the first time, Bill and Hillary Clinton…other than those people, I have never voted for anyone that I really believed in…not one.

I will do my best to pick a candidate that can knock Trump/Pence out, and I can hope that person will actually be someone I would be proud of as my President. Anyone other than our dear Hillary, for me, will just be a ho hum person.

I hope others bring their passions forward on their candidates, in the end, we will go into that voting booth alone, with our one little vote and hope for the best.

It will kill me if another woman becomes the first female President, that is Hillary spot.

Fredster, great post! Yes, we all remember PUMA very well, I also voted for McCain in 2008, first and last time I ever voted for a Repub for President.

I really like Harris, but am like the rest of you. There are a lot of great candidates running. Let’s see what happens!

Hillary’s qualifications will never be equalled. She is Our Girl forever! And she should be President now.

I still have a PUMA button, with the puma in red, white and blue.

Ah, I wrote a pretty long post, then because I am using a different computer than the one I use at work, WP asked me to put in my password as I pressed ‘Post Comment’, so after putting in my password, I tried posting and it said I already did..but the post was lost.

I don’t feel like saying it all over again, but I ditto some of the things others have written:

PUMA sentiments- and I will add that I marched in Denver with lots of PUMAs for Hillary, she is the only candidate I have ever donated to and have a small wardrobe of t-shirts to help pay off her debt, and the one that is still hanging in my closet, worn for part of one night, the night of the election, ‘Madam President’, ‘I believe in HER’, in gold lettering, a designer shirt. I want to wear that t-shirt so much, I want to show my pride at having her as my President. I just can’t get over it.
Ditto on MB’s statements….

There are a lot of great candidates running. Let’s see what happens!

Hillary’s qualifications will never be equaled. She is Our Girl forever! And she should be President now.


@7: Shadow I found your comment so I’ll add it in here.

You know what really pi$$es me off? Hearing people say that I need to get over it and move on. That no one runs a third time and her time is up.

She effin’ won and it is getting treated like she lost and should just go away or help others win that are younger.

Shit it clipped off the last part of the calendar.

When I want to take a trip down memory lane to the rules and bylaws committee on 5/31/08, Harold Ickes’ empassioned speech is just the ticket. I will try to link it here, but being the perennial Luddite, it may not appear as planned. ( did not work, but Google “Ickes DNC” and the YouTube should appear.

@14: Here ya go lililam.

Fredste,r thank you for finding my first post. Now I know that I am not losing my mind and the text actually went somewhere.

14 & 15

Yes, that was the beginning of the nightmare.

@16: No problem shadow. Indeed those are the types of things that will drive you up the wall. Now imagine it happening to a post you’re working on! It’s happened. Grrrrr

Ack, an entire post…I would have to run around the house cussing a blue streak.

@19: I believe it’s happened to every one of us. I know it’s happened to me, mb, and chat.

WordPress is supposed to autosave the things every so often but after a time or two I decided to start saving mine more frequently.

Thanks, Fredster! Maddening stuff. He spoke for us while few others seemed to notice the enormity of the crisis.

Agree with you all about the new candidates. I’ll never love a candidate like I did Hillary, and will probably never let myself care that much again. I too like Kamala best at this time also, but it’s early,

I found the sister (and brother!) hood of the Puma movement very comforting. That was a rough period for my little family, my stepson died, Laker had to have surgery on both legs, and my stepmom decided to ditch my Dad when he started showing signs of Alzheimers, and it fell to me to take care of him. So getting online at night after everyone was in bed, and venting my anger at the political system with my Puma comrades was very helpful. I think its awesome that many of us are still hanging together, after all those years!

Harold Ickes was brilliant in that response.

((Social @22))
I am so sorry for all the family hardships you went though. Those times where hard enough, and I am glad you found some comfort with all your PUMA friends.

I think Hillary’s PUMAs saved a lot of us at that time and there are many of us at this and other sites that are still together.

When the Ickes thing happened, I was unaware of blogging at Hillary’s site and thought I was going to lose my mind. I didn’t have a clue about what to do to deal with my sorrow and anger, and I followed someone’s comment on Hillary’s site to PUMApac, ended up going to Denver with those folks, then wandered to several other sites when Murphy left the pac. It’s been 12 years and I couldn’t imagine walking away from Hillary supporters after all this time.

Damn WP, I’ve lost another comment. [snarl]

@27: Not sure, but PUMApac might be one of those words that triggers the comment going to holding for review. Couldn’t see any other things that might have triggered that.

What The Left Gets Wrong About Bernie Sanders And Elizabeth Warren
The super-rich see one thing very clearly.

Thank you Fredster, again!

Love the business about Schulzie not usually voting. Hopefully after the Dump-like namecalling he goes down the memory hole never to be seen again.

Yes, 45 was rightfully Hillary’s. (Actually, 2008 was rightfully hers, but that was primaries cheating, so not quite the same.) If people stop being such bigots about female Presidents, a lot of the credit has to go to her. Through both those robberies, she cleared the way. But I’ll still get a warm glow if another sensible capable woman wins. If she cleared the way and all that happened is we got someone like Sarah Huckster, I’d just get on the next alien spaceship outta here.

Quixote, very cool that you went to Denver. I can only imagine what an experience it must have been.

Luna @30, Can you believe this arrogant, obnoxious asshole?!?

Quixote @31, Agree 100%.

(Not me, Annie. I think it was Shadow who managed to go to Denver. I wish I could have!)

@32, oops! I did mean to say that to Shadowfax! Did I ever tell you guys I have ADHD & dyslexia?

@34, me too!

@33, LOLOL

Fun with critters on Fridays. (smugly) I got today’s picture correct.

Kitty jump, so cute.

Cory is in the race:

Well, can’t say we don’t have good candidates.

It’s going to be a loooong ‘primary’ season before the primaries even start.

@39: I have to wonder how many of these folks are actually doing an audition for the veep slot?

Well, it’s not like he actually paid any attention to these things.

White House Abruptly Canceled Trump’s Meeting With Intel Chiefs

@37: There is an orange and white kitteh that hangs around here. I asked the neighbor on other side of duplex if it was theirs and they said nope. She’s very friendly.

So yesterday she was around and I got a can of that canned chicken I had for the possible storm right after I moved back. She practically inhaled it so while I was gone to pickup lunch/dinner for me and a friend, the friend put out another can of it and the cat was eating that when I got back.

My friend said it could be that someone had her for a pet and then possibly moved and left her behind. Kitteh has no collar but as I said friendly has hell.

And no, I don’t want an inside kitteh.

Fredster, would you consider taking kitty to a vet to see if she was microchipped? She may be lost. Also, a lot of rescues microchip and would take the cat if it is one they processed. Long shot, I know.

@45: Oh Lordy! A cat in a carrier inside my truck. I don’t have ear protection for that. LOL

I could call the parish animal shelter and ask if they could check for me and they would prolly have a carrier I could borrow. But I better go to Home Depot first and get some gloves.

@46, Fredster, i don’t want you to get hurt! I thought when you said she was friendly you could pick her up. Do you have any friends who know cats? I have to scruff mine to get them in a carrier to go to the vet and covering the carrier once she is in may keep her quiet. Hopefully she is not an unspayed female. Why don’t you call the parish animal shelter first and see what they recommend.

@48: Oh Cats, she is friendly. She’ll do that winding through your legs thing and a couple of times laid down so I gave her some belly rubs. At the same time she once gave me a nip on the finger that I *thought* was a friendly thing but it was sharp! LOL

As far as unspayed, we might know soon. A couple of weeks ago I was given an unwanted cat duet by my side gate! Might find out soon if she was a party to it.

Simply wrap the cat in a towel. Quickly. Not all cats are loud when in a strange place. Oh, and cats nearly always show by their body language when they want petting and when they’ve decided they’ve had enough. Unfortunately many hooomans don’t read cat.

Is the cat skinny? She may have had bad humans who moved and left her. 😦 Indoor kittehs are very nice — lapwarmers, pillowpurrers, and companions.

Fredster @41, ditto that. @47, Omg, that is so cool!

I’ve seen some speculation that Sherrod Brown might run. I like him and his wife.

Luna @40, Looong is right! Ugh!

@50: She’s not really skinny. Laurie, the friend also thought it possible that someone moved off and left her. Grrrr. Her son in Lafayette La had something similar happen and now that kitteh is his family’s indoor cat.

And I know indoor cats are great; we had some over the years but the parental units and I were more of Rover, bow-wow folks. LOL

Oh and the friend Laurie actually owns the duplex. She came over to help me put together two tables I had in storage in Alabama. She did most of the putting together. LOL And the coffee table is WAY bigger than I thought. It also has casters/rollers on it. Got it together and placed and she says to me “If you get up and for some reason think you’re gonna lose your balance, DONT fall toward the coffee table because you’ll roll straight into the entertainment thing and the 55 ” tv will come down on your head”.

I laughed and said “Oh no, another needless death due to excessive tv watching”. I guess it would be better to fall face first onto the tile floor.

@52: I’ve heard that too annie. I saw something on a show (MSNBC?) where one of the people said all the candidates so far have been from the “progressive” side of the party and that Sherrod would be more of a “traditional” Democratic candidate. This person also said he would cut into any support Biden has. Good.

I stand by my prediction that neither Bernie nor Biden will run. The second Warren announced, Bernie was dust. Not only does she have better plans and ideas about wealth inequality, she can actually put it to paper as a bill and articulate it to the public. None of which Bernie has ever been able to do. And never will. As far as Uncle Gropey goes, he’s “missed his window”. Again. Three or four times now. IOW, he didn’t make it out of Iowa, where you would think he could. He’s done.

I love the puppy dragging the avalanche ‘victim’ out. As a full grown dog, he/she could probably pull them out unconscious. Most skiers these days wear GPS trackers if they’re skiing in iffy areas.

@57: Wasn’t that such a good clip? Hope you’re right about the pupper.

Hahaha! As a Seattleite, I love this! We do not like him here.

I’d have a doggo if I had more time free and if I had a bigger yard. I grew up with both.

@60: Doesn’t have to be a big ole dawg.

@61: Mom: I tole you, you worked on my very last nerve!!

Ugh. Just checked pollen count and it’s medium high, mostly trees and highest are bald cypress, elm and maple. At least it’s not those damned pine trees.

Probably won’t be around much tomorrow-Sunday because I’m going to a Boycott Bowl shindig. No offense to you annie but you know “we was robbed”!

However, mb assured me she would/could take a Sunday post so there should be something new coming up.

@64 This is a conversation I had with my Faux news watching mother less than 3 months ago.

Her: I just wish they would leave him alone and let him do his job.

Me: Who’s stopping him? He has the full majority. If anyone is stopping him, it must be the Republicans. And if he truly wants to ‘get things done’ maybe he should stop going to one of his golf resorts every weekend to play golf.

Her: Golf? (puzzled look) I’ve never seen him play golf.

Me: (literally lays head on table)

@67: Now GAgal, did you lay your head on the table or did you bang your head on the table?

Welp, another reason for #boycottbowl

@68 Now that I think about it, my elbow was already on the table and I bent it and put my head on my arm. Not gonna bang my own arm. Or my own head.

By the way, if you boycott the Super Bowl maybe your party can watch the Puppy Bowl on Animal Planet channel.

@70: The thing I’m planning to go to is a second line parade that starts at 2 pm and then there’s a “Bury the Bowl” funeral parade that forms at the Kingpin Bar, 1307 Lyons Street, at 4 p.m.

I know one place (bar) is going to play the Super Bowl the Saints won and will show the Puppy Bowl also.

The event at 2pm starts at Jackson Square so that means finding parking and then hoofing to the Square. Parking will probably be spotty and iffy as well as $$s.

The other place is probably where I’ll go. The Kingpin is not far off St.Charles Ave and is supposed to be a great place to watch a Saints game. I want to go there for the “Bury the Bowl” funeral parade. Oddly or not so, this being NOLA, it sounds like fun.

@71: They have some photos of the place here:

I don’t have a FB acct but could see some of the photos.

@72, I see a doxie there in one of the pics!

You couldn’t pay me enough to sleep in one of these things!

Sunday post coming soon y’all!

Fredster @ 71, a funeral parade for a Bowl game. I love New Orleans! Wish I could be there.

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