The Widdershins

Late Sunday & Monday post: Madam Secretary’s health

Posted on: September 11, 2016


Good evening Widdershins!

As I mentioned on the previous post, Hillary was at the 9/11 ceremonies in NYC and then had to leave.  Her spokesperson said she was “overcome” with the heat and dehydrated.  She was taken to Chelsea’s apartment, rested and was rehydrated.  As she was leaving the apartment Hillary looked fine.

The BBC had this to say about the situation:

Dr Lisa Bardack said she was diagnosed with pneumonia on Friday and given antibiotics, but had become dehydrated at the New York event.


Hilz leaving Chelsea's apt.

Hilz leaving Chelsea’s apt.


The doctor’s statement said she was now re-hydrated and “recovering nicely”.

“Secretary Clinton has been experiencing a cough related to allergies. On Friday, during follow up evaluation of her prolonged cough, she was diagnosed with pneumonia,” Dr Bardack’s statement said.

“She was put on antibiotics, and advised to rest and modify her schedule,” it went on.

There are so many things to say here about the “health brouhaha” going on.

First, she’s traveling/flying all over the country right now.  It has mostly been in smaller, corporate type aircraft but she’s now added the B 737-800.  Still, she is constantly airborne and dealing with pressurized cabins which can definitely affect your respiratory tract, sinuses and the like.  Ask anyone who had done a great deal of flying in their careers.  Prlolix, mb, would y’all agree?

Second, okay she was diagnosed with pneumonia.  As GAgal and I commented we’ve either had pneumonia or known someone who had it and they were given a script for antibiotics and went on their merry way.

Third, what kind of antibiotic was she given?  If it was a Zpack or other mycin drug, many times there are warnings on those to avoid a lot of direct sunlight.  So let’s say she was given azithromycin.  She probably started it Friday and then Sunday, there she is out in the heat and sunlight.  Shame Hillary!  I tend to believe she was given a mycin drug of some type because another side effect is photosensitivity and there she was with those big ole sunglasses on.

Fourth, should we be worried?  Not really.  She is constantly on the road campaigning and while she may not be sleeping at the local Motel 6 she’s also not flying home each night to sleep in her own bed at, say, Trump Tower, as the yam does.

As Politico said, this may affect her planned trip to California, but ya know, Cali will still be there.

As the BBC piece said:

George HW Bush once vomited on a Japanese prime minister. His son fainted in the White House after choking on a pretzel. Franklin Roosevelt hid his serious health conditions, and John F Kennedy never spoke of his debilitating back condition.

The BBC piece also goes on with a “yes, but” thing

The difference between these men and Hillary Clinton, however, is that her “overheating” episode – the apparent result of a case of pneumonia – comes in the home stretch of a presidential campaign where she seeks to tie Ronald Reagan as the oldest person ever elected to a first term as president.

Fair enough but once she’s in the White House she won’t be constantly flying around the country.  When she does travel as President she’ll have a bed on the 747 where she can rest, and sleep if she wishes to.  And she won’t be doing that each and every day.

I’m not sure exactly how much information we as the electorate are actually entitled to know about our candidates.  Clinton has released a statement from her internist that provided her overall health status in 2015.  Her vitals and lab results were excellent.  Are we entitled to ask for any more?  And if we are, then both candidates should be held to the same standards.


As usual, this is an open thread to take wherever you wish.



100 Responses to "Late Sunday & Monday post: Madam Secretary’s health"

I don’t even want to *think* about what the a.m. tawk shows are going to do with the “health” issues.

People still think of pneumonia as ‘the killer’ from years ago. Bacterial pneumonia is only dangerous to very elderly or people prone to have other health issues. Or people who wait too long to treat it and it settles into the lungs, especially the lower lungs. Hillary had her doctor follow up on her cough (it ALL goes back to the allergies) as she should have. Given a few more days, it most likely would be cleared up.

So, she was diagnosed on Friday. The same day she attended a two hour national security meeting, did two fundraisers, gave a presser and did an interview with Cuomo on CNN. She may have felt perfectly fine on her way to the memorial, then overheated. I don’t think anything would have stopped her from going.

GAgal said: I don’t think anything would have stopped her from going.

Oh me either.

I changed the “tag” for the comment thingie. What do ya think?

Something else I’ve noticed since I’m short myself. I see Hillary in the middle of groups of people who are all taller than her (especially SS) all the time. I’ve been in crowds like that and it’s suffocating. It’s like your not getting your share of air. Add the heat and humidity and the actual body heat coming off every one crowded around you… If there’s a breeze blowing, short people can’t feel it. It’s “up there” somewhere. It’s one of the reasons I don’t like crowds.

Welp, WaPo couldn’t even wait until tomorrow to start.

Okay they have to give her one of these to have around all the time.

A comment from the WaPo article:

Cheney was a walking medical nightmare. Bush was a dry drunk who was one second away from a drink. He supposedly choked on a pretzel, passed out and fell. Reagan had signs of Alzheimer’s when he ran for his second term.

Right wingers never cared about all of this. Go figure.

@4 Well, um… considering I just now realized the tags are at the bottom of the post… 😳

@9: What I meant was the “share your thoughts” thing. I didn’t know what to call it.

@8 George HW Bush threw up all over the Japanese prime minister, apparently from a strong medication we didn’t know he was taking. Gerald Ford tripped every few days.

@11: Yes, but Hillary…


I’ll have to read the WaPo link later. I can’t get it to load right now. There were at least 15 articles about this headlined on memorandum earlier. I didn’t read a single one. Sometimes I wonder if these reporters ever go home an night, look in the mirror and say ‘God, I made a fool of myself today’.

Okay, check your blood pressure because this is going to send it right through the roof. This guy is nine kinds of despicable — I’m not sure he has redeemable characteristics — I’m not sure his mother even likes him.

Martin Shkreli taunts Clinton outside apartment after 9/11 ceremony.

@14: Oh, if only he had been “menacing” and a S.S. agent had been close by.

Yes Fredster. When I was flying every week I had constant respiratory maladies. I carried Zicam swabs and Purell in my briefcase at all times. I was constantly dried out, stuffed up, and hacking like a cat with a hair ball the size of Montana.

According to the Borowitz Report:

In a hypothetical matchup between a Clinton who has been rendered completely unconscious versus a fully sentient Trump, voters chose an inert Clinton over an ambulatory Trump by a margin of nine percentage points.

@15, the S.S. would have called Animal Control.

@14 He and Trump have a lot in common. They’re both being investigated for fraud. Maybe they’ll have neighboring cells in “prison”. It will be interesting to see if they both buy their way out it.

The day my doctor surprised me when she told me I had pneumonia, I went back to work and “Y’all aren’t gonna believe this. I have pneumonia.” My boss said, “What? Do you want to go home?” I said, “Hell no, I feel better just knowing what that was. I’ve got my antibiotics and I’m good to go.”

@20, now in the great false equivalency two-step, it is gonna be Trump fraud/bigotry, blah, blah, blah versus Hillary’s sick and didn’t tell us. Only would the American press have a presidential candidate get sick and then make the story about the press not being called before the doctor.

Since Trump is going on Dr. Oz to talk about his health, maybe Oz can go “down under” and figure out how he can breathe with his head up his big orange butt.

Just clicked on a WaPo article titled “Secret Service followed atypical protocol with Clinton’s early departure from Sunday 9/11 event”. Here’s the first paragraph:

Editor’s note: This story has been updated to remove the assertion that the Secret Service may have broken protocol in responding to Clinton’s illness, which was published before the agency was able to respond. In a statement sent later, a spokesman for the agency said that “at no time did any Secret Service personnel violate security protocols.”


Good post Fredster. Like your new sidebar pic–so true!

I forgot to mention one of the authors of that already debunked article was Anne Gearan.

@25: Anne Gearan could not write a complimentary or sympathetic word on Hillary or any other Clinton if her life depended on it.

@20: That was the same as that nurse when mom was at the n.h. I was asking “Oh, don’t you need to be home and resting?”. She said no she was okay to work just had to go through the Z-pack and should be fine.

Good article in the Independent about tRumps shenanigans in Latin America:

There’s the usual bankruptcies that left his investors losing millions, while he made huge profits, the kicking of families out of existing buildings to make way for another of his failed enterprises, the friendship with the family of a dictator, etc, etc, etc.

Then there’s this choice quote:

‘In the US, Mr Trump refuses to release his tax returns and told supporters in Iowa in January, regarding tax: “I mean, I pay as little as possible. I use every single thing in the book.”’

Loved your tombstone motif, Fredster. If the U.S. media weren’t already dead, quotes like the one above would be familiar to everyone. Instead, all I hear people around me repeating is the latest media trash and alarmism about Hillary.

@14: I see the Feds added new charges to Shkreli back in June of this year. I hope he’s found guilty, that the SEC forbids him from trading or having anything else to do with the market and that he just withers away.

@28: Can’t claim it as original Pat, but when I saw it I knew I had to “borrow” it and put it to good use here. LOL

From GAgal’s WaPo link at 23:

The incident also raised questions about Clinton’s traveling group of reporters, which she left behind at Ground Zero when she departed unexpectedly, leaving the press with no knowledge of her whereabouts or condition for about 90 minutes.

Nah, didn’t raise a single question with me and probably not with Hillary, Bill, Chelsea, the grandkids and the rest of the U.S.

@31 LOL! Me neither, Fredster.

The WaPo’s official thesaurus must list “raised questions” as one of the more acceptable alternatives for “created baseless rumours”.

@32: You know who I bet is going to make a big, humongous, YUGE thing out this later today? Mrs. Greenspan. And I’d really like to know if she was even at the event today and second, if she wasn’t, then where will she be getting her info on the situation.

@33 Yep. And the title on CNN “Clinton stumbles, will her campaign follow”

@34: It’s just disgusting, isn’t it contrask?

Well I’m calling it a night/morning. I don’t dare watch any of the morning tawk shows. The b.s. is going to be thigh deep.

I like the “share your thoughts” tagline! Looking good.

Yup, flying is notoriously bad for the sinuses. You get so dried out, and there is always at least one close seatmate who is hacking up a lung, so you are exposed to everyone else’s illnesses too. I used my saline rinse constantly when I was traveling by plane every week.

You know, Donald Trump is older than Hillary and he hasn’t released his health records, just a forged letter saying his baboons butt is the reddest of any Presidential candidate evah! Amazing how he hasn’t suffered a single consequence for this.

Just to note that JFK had Addison’s Disease, an incurable disease of the adrenal glands. I think he took Cortisone which sometimes made his face look puffy. While everyone knew about his back problem, the much more serious and potentially fatal Addison’s was not made public until after he died.

Roz in NJ/NYC

Here’s a new one to make it appear like a horse race — suddenly Georgia and Arizona have become “traditional battleground states”. Neither have gone Democratic since “Hector was a pup” — just another way to make it a race and more “watchable”.

Saw this at Uppity’s- might explain the sickness issue, bunch of staffers got sick:

@36: mb, when I saw at the “innards” of the blog that you could change that text I thought “eh, why not something different?”. Just a change of pace.

@36, the no consequences ever for the Dumpsterfire business. Yeah. WHY? Even clickbait can’t explain that. People would click on breathless gossip about the Becheetoed Baloney (with the minor difference that in his case it’s both true and significant) just as much on breathless BS about Clinton.

Sarah Kendzior has been on this. Why aren’t the media going for this obvious — and socially useful — clickbait? Her theory is he’s got blackmail on them or he’s bought them off. Seems crazy. But then, pre-Snowden, I thought it was a bit nutty to think the gubmint really would be spying on everyone everywhere.

@38: Oh yeah? “Battleground states”? Since when?

What a crock and they’ll have people believing their horse hockey. Grrrr!

@42: quixote I saw something about that in all of my wanderings through the intertubz. I should have bookmarked it.

@39: From the People article, of all the folks to cite, they quoted Nicolle Wallace:

That’s why one veteran of the campaign trail, Nicolle Wallace, former communications adviser to President George W. Bush, says Sunday’s belated disclosure of her pneumonia diagnosis – at a time when polls show that Clinton’s trustworthiness is seriously questioned by a substantial chunk of voters – is more a political issue than a real medical one.

This shows, Wallace said on NBC’s Today, that “the Clintons can’t come clean about anything, including cold and flu season.”

Yeah Nicolle and you lied to us about Sarah Palin when you were an advisor to McCain’s campaign. You implied Palin had a functioning brain.

@46: Ah, thanks quixote. 🙂

I knew I saw something about it, perhaps as a link on another site.

Sorry I’ve been here so sporadically. I think I had a slight case of food poisoning. I’m feeling better but my balance is way off. I’m enjoying my first cup of coffee since last Thursday now. 🙂

Fredster, I FINALLY see the share your thoughts tag. I like it!

@49: Thank ye GAgal. 🙂 I was just futzing around with stuff.

@48: Oh no! 😵

Glad you’re feeling better. Are you sure that’s what it was?

Perhaps you should share all of your medical history with us.

We won’t share or tell. We promise.

Of course they have because the media are gullible fools:

What this whole episode has proved is that people like Roger Stone and Steve Bannon have gotten into the media’s collective head.

Hillary said of Trump ‘where is the bottom?’ The media needs to be asked ‘where is the lowest of low’?

@51 All I can say is my bout of pneumonia was nothing – nothing – compared to the last few days.

@53: Definitely. Food poisoning can be icky, miserable stuff.

Oh GAGal, I totally relate. I had food poisoning for almost a week once. It was so bad I called the poison hotline! Here’s hoping the worst is over.

It looks like the media is starting to call BS on Trump a bit. They are back to talking about his medical records again, and his taxes too. Basket of deplorables was a great line, and I don’t think it will hurt her one bit. My favorite thing people say is, “Well, she shouldn’t have said ‘half’ the voters.” So it’s wrong only because she picked the wrong percentage? 😇

@48, GAgal, sorry that you aren’t feeling good. In keeping with the standard the clamoring Yam’s people have for Hillary, you should have announced the first sign of dyspepsia and followed up with no less than a MRI and CAT scan.

I know how icky food poisoning can be. I had it once and it took me a week to even want to look at food.

@55, MB, truth be spoke — the percentage of the Trump campaign fronting “deplorables” is even higher than half. It’s more like 60%. I’m going to touch on that Wednesday.

@56 Prolix said:

you should have announced the first sign of dyspepsia and followed up with no less than a MRI and CAT scan.

That is correct. And then provide the results to us.

Tweety on Hardball and the banner at the bottom of the screen something like “Clinton health scare: is campaign being transparent enough”. And who does he have at the “roundtable”? Anne Gearan who wrote the first overblown piece about the event. Puhleeze!

They keep the conversation on the “half” because they don’t want to talk about Hill’s message about who is running Trump’s campaign. This is not some random supporters. This is who HE brought in to run his campaign! And the media are too uncomfortable to cover the truth in what she said. Also, notice they are not covering the second part of her message – about people who have not recovered form the bad economy, etc. – at all. They just go on and on about the deplorables remark without mentioning people in the other ‘basket’ to make her look bad.

me@59: I’m so glad they have MNF tonight. I can ignore the talking blabbering heads.

@59 Gearan was on with Tameron Hall this morning and they had a nice, long chat about Hillary’s health. There was no mention of Gearan’s ridiculous article OR the one she wrote saying the SS had used atypical protocol that she had to correct after they actually bothered to .. you know.. ask the SS.

@62: Heh. I’m willing to bet that if Gearan had been on Joy Reid’s show she would have asked about that.

Let me see if this works here. That was a no it doesn’t embed.

So go here to check out all of the people at the Bama game who got overheated and dehydrated.

As you’ll see, fairly young people who, in some cases, had to be transported to the hospital.

@64, Hell, I’ve gotten overheated going to the refrigerator to get ice water.

@65: (well hell!)

For an interlude from the media obsessing about whether or not Hillary is coughing up loogies.

The NCAA announced it is pulling its championship events from North Carolina because of the state’s laws targeting gays.

Thank you Rachel Maddow for bringing sanity back to the conversation! Dr Natalie Azur just laid it all out the way it should have been from the beginning. It’s been driving me crazy that they have been questioning the professionalism and ethics of Hillary’s doctor. (I’m looking at you Gupta for constantly saying Hill should be seen by an independent doctor – insinuating hers is trying to hide something)

GAgal, glad you’re doing better! I know it can be really rough. I had to take hubs to the ER in Jan. cuz he had it so bad. Hope you have lots of comfort foods to help ease you back into life.

ah, the “new” LA Rams first official game is on. Fredster, are you rooting for LA or SF?

@70: Well annie, I wanted to root for the Rams, but all I saw were big goose eggs for their score. And just now checking, they’ve still got goose eggs, SF-28, Rams-zip? And the Rams aren’t supposed to even be that good this year.

GAgal@68: O’Donnell is getting even better on the health issue. I rarely agree with him but so far he’s been spot on. He said the media “collectively lost their minds”. Tweety was the worst tonight on MSNBC.
I say that but I didn’t see Hayes. I avoid him totally.

I like Anderson Cooper, but he has no control over his panel and I think he prefers that. Fired/NotFired Corey talks all over people when it’s their turn to speak, usually after he’s allowed to go first. Not only is him letting them be rude to his other guest, taking up their allotted time, but when two people are talking at the same time you can’t hear a word either one are saying. Maybe he can because he’s sitting right there, but I can’t. It’s a waste of time so might as well change the channel.

I just remember something I saw yesterday while I was half dozing. Gloria Borger was chiding Hillary for making her deplorables comments in a “closed” fundraiser. Back from commercial she had to apologize and admit it was not closed since the press were actually there to report it. ‘I apologize for that. I was wrong.’ 😀 Wonder who called her out on it.

@74: Perhaps a quick tweet from a Clinton staffer?

@76: That’s bizarre. But then he did mention Putin.

This is hilarious. Watch this poor Cspan guy try to keep a straight face and decide when to hit the hang up button.

@78: Oh geez!!! “Since she’s been wearing pantsuits”. When wasn’t she wearing pantsuits in the last decade or maybe two?

Everyone knows Hillary told the truth about the deplorables. She sven prefaced her remarks with the note that she was grossly overgeneralizing. Honestly I think it was brilliant. It was a lawyerly Clintonian way to get that meme out there. And the media looks ridiculous for trying to push her into recanting.

Will any tell Chaffetz that what he’s doing is an abuse of power?

“No matter what Director Comey does, it will never be enough for Republicans,” Cummings said. “They are demanding that he bring criminal charges against Secretary Clinton despite the fact that the evidence is simply not there, and that is something nobody with any integrity would ever do.”

@71, haha, agree with you. Actually I don’t really like Rams or SF. Never did. Hubs is an old time Rams fan, he watched the game and said they looked awful. Ah well, good for the economy anyway.

@83: Actually annie I meant the 49ers weren’t supposed to be that good, but the same goes for the Rams. I have a feeling the Saints are going to be pretty odious also.

Good on for these three guys who asserted their rights under the Constitution when called before Chaffetz’s Inquisition.

Pagliano also refused to answer questions last year before a House panel investigating the deadly 2012 attacks in Benghazi, Libya.

“He has never made any statement or taken any action that would constitute a waiver of his constitutional rights and there is no reason for anyone to believe he might suddenly depart from that position,” Pagliano’s lawyers wrote in the Sept. 13 letter to Rep. Jason Chaffetz, R-Utah, the Oversight committee chairman.

Chaffetz said there will be consequences for Pagliano’s refusal to appear and for “thumbing his nose at Congress.” He didn’t specify what the penalties would be.

Someone please play the McCarthy clip for Jason.

I added a link under Politics to Hillary’s doctor’s 2015 statement on her health. If you’ve never read it, check it out. It will open a pdf version of the statement.

Hey GAgal, Prolix and I sent you a couple of emails when you have a chance to check them out.

Thanks! 🙂


@85, interesting link. Its hard to believe these jerks are still pursuing this nonsense. I wish the Dems would dig up some stuff on these guys and publicize it.

@89: And notice how Chaffetz and his committee acted with the two private individuals from the network company:

Two officials from Denver-based Platte River Networks appeared before the committee but invoked their constitutional right not to testify. Bill Thornton and Paul Combetta were excused from the session. In June 2013, after Clinton had left office, the server was moved from her home to a data center in northern New Jersey, where it was maintained by the Platte River Networks.

Chaffetz is a miserable little punk and someone needs to slap him down.

The journalists were appalled at not going to the doctor with Hillary.


@91: Huh, what? Do you have a link Luna?

I see Prolix’s guv is trying to act like lil booby jindal. I hope he fails as badly as bobby did.

@93, I fear Bevin took lessons from Piyush and the student is going to exceed the teacher in jacka$$ery.

@94: If he falls on his face as badly as Piyush it will be fun to watch.

Tomorrow Eichenwald is to release something in Newsweek.



@92, no, I was being sarcastic. Yeah, parody seems to be factual these days!

Oh okay. I would totally believe they would expect something like that! Grrrr.

Fredster, LOL. Agree.

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